Episode 178 - Why Overthinking Keeps Us From Doing What We Want with Priyanka Venugopal
Overthinking can cost you more than time. It can keep you from taking chances and becoming the person who can have what you want. In this episode, you’ll hear a conversation with Dr. Priyanka Venugopal about what it took to move from thinking “Probably not me” to “Why not me?” and pursue a dream without having any evidence that it would work. This mindset shift helped her lose over 60 pounds without counting calories and prepared her to take the stage for her TEDx Talk. It’s not easy, but when you learn to make peace with the idea of failure and be proud of yourself just for trying, so much becomes possible.
How long have you been putting off the hard conversation? Join Sara live for one hour for her free workshop, SPEAK UP. There’s no replay, so bring the conversation you keep avoiding. You’ll learn the Three Speak Up Skills and figure out what’s keeping you stuck.
Here’s what you’ll uncover in this episode:
How to break the habit of treating disappointment as proof that you did something wrong
Why desire will start to outweigh the fear surrounding something when you really want it
How to think about rejection as information instead of turning it into self-criticism
How overthinking can turn something you care about into a performance
The benefit of seeking support if you’re used to figuring things out on your own
Find Priyanka here:
https://youtu.be/-p6KtUizbvs?si=gw38DixCjlL9TyED
https://www.instagram.com/dr.priyankavenugopal/
https://priyankavenugopal.com/
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-burn-stress-lose-weight-podcast/id1618073362
Dr. Priyanka Venugopal is an OB-GYN physician, podcaster, TEDx speaker, and entrepreneur. She’s also a coffee-lover and self-proclaimed expert overthinker. After losing 60 pounds while juggling call shifts and two young kids, she discovered the real problem for smart women was never a lack of discipline... it was the time and energy lost to overthinking. Today she helps overachieving professional women reach their next goal in health, home, or career — and get back the 10+ hours a week overthinking quietly steals.
Register for SPEAK UP: sarafisk.coach/voice
Find Sara here:
pages.sarafisk.coach/difficultconversations
youtube.com/@sarafiskcoaching1333
Transcript
Sara Bybee Fisk 00:58
Hey, you guys. My friend recorded a TEDx Talk, and we are talking about it today. I am joined by my friend and fellow coach, Dr. Priyanka Venugopal. And you and I have had a lot of conversations over the years. I have watched your coaching career develop, and I have watched you kind of blossom into this really amazing coach with, interestingly enough, a really unique voice in what I tend to think of as kind of a crowded space, weight loss.
Priyanka Venugopal 01:30
Absolutely.
Sara Bybee Fisk 01:31
And that's hard to do.
Priyanka Venugopal 01:32
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 01:32
It's hard to have something new to say-
Priyanka Venugopal 01:34
Mm-hmm
Sara Bybee Fisk 01:34
... something new to contribute that isn't just eat less and exercise more. And you know, that, that, that message that is so tired, and actually s- applicable in actually so few cases.And I'm just thrilled that you have had a chance to be on a stage. It happened just this last Saturday, yeah?
Priyanka Venugopal 01:55
Yeah, yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 01:56
That's pretty-
Priyanka Venugopal 01:57
It's w- first of all, Sara, I adore you so much. Thank you so much for having me. To everyone listening, I'm so glad and excited to be here.I feel like my face is still flush from excitement from delivering this talk, and I, I love that you... Thank you for sharing that because I agree. I think that weight loss is a very crowded space. I think that the messaging is very eat less, move more, track calories, be in a calorie deficit. Like, that is the, that is the language. And for many, many years, as we've talked about before, I tried that approach. Yeah, and even with my physician hat on, I think that I thought that was the correct way, quote-unquote correct way, and if it worked, why wasn't it working for me? Something must be wrong with me. Um, but my foray into coaching really was realizing actually mindset has a huge role that I didn't realize was costing me my health goals, my weight loss goals, and turning that over on its head, learning how to lose. I lost a little over 60 pounds without counting a single calorie, without food FOMO or deprivations literally changed my life.And I say now, just kind of to segue even into this conversation, my health journey is what prepared me for my TEDx journey.
Sara Bybee Fisk 03:08
Mm.
Priyanka Venugopal 03:08
I had to go through that experience first to mentally be prepared for what this last year entailed, which was hard. Um, but I'm just sitting with so much gratitude for just going on the journey. So that's-
Sara Bybee Fisk 03:24
Okay
Priyanka Venugopal 03:24
... the short, the short and long to say thank you for having me.
Sara Bybee Fisk 03:26
Well, I... And, and that's why I wanted to, to have this conversation because your input into the weight loss space is really invaluable, and if anyone is wanting to have a, a healthy weight loss journey, absolutely you need to be following Priyanka, and all her information will be in the show notes. But I was really just fascinated as I saw you posting about the preparation for this, and I had so many questions.
Priyanka Venugopal 03:56
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 03:57
When did you know that you wanted to do a TEDx Talk?
Priyanka Venugopal 04:02
Okay. In 2021, 20- I think it was 2021, I was doing an advanced certification with Bev, who you know.
Sara Bybee Fisk 04:11
Mm-hmm.
Priyanka Venugopal 04:11
And in that coaching experience and in that certification, someone happened to just mention offhandedly that they were doing a TEDx Talk.
Sara Bybee Fisk 04:19
Mm-hmm.
Priyanka Venugopal 04:19
And I remember my brain immediately exploded because I had at that, up until that point, thought that TEDx only accepted, like, some type of an influencer, famous person, author, someone of note that has a huge following. I didn't realize that, for lack of a better word, "regular people," I'm putting in air quotes, could do this.
Sara Bybee Fisk 04:42
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 04:42
So when she shared her experience, I remember getting this, like, inspiration bug bite in the best way. It was like an itch, and I was like... I felt my, my, my entire body light up with this idea. It was like an imagination, like imagining myself sharing what to me is a very important idea. And then immediately, like three seconds later, I was like, "Probably not you. Probably not you. Like, who do you think you are? No one really wants to hear what you have to say." I, like, immediately, like, my practical brain turned on with how it's probably not going to happen, and that thought drove me to take the action of, like, not trying.Like, why bother trying? Because it probably won't happen. So that was in 2021. And I would say I held that kind of small inspiration bug in my mind. Even though I kept squashing it down, it kind of kept bubbling up, uh, until last year. Um, I was at my retreat. And you know, usually you, you imagine when you're hosting a retreat, the retreat attendees are the ones that are experiencing the transformation, but as the host also, you're in the energy of this retreat.
Sara Bybee Fisk 05:52
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 05:52
And I remember at that retreat I had the thought, "Why not me? Why, why not? Like, why am I not... Why am I holding back on- ... something that I think could be really phenomenal and amazing. And so that was when I made this decision to really try, like really try.And I made an agreement with myself, which is, we're gonna try, and it's, it might be challenging, but we're gonna treat ourselves really well on the way. And so that was when I decided. It was, uh, last year, and I still, I mean, I still remember that feeling of just the excitement, of letting the inspiration bug out and like, like, let's water this instead of squashing it down.
Sara Bybee Fisk 06:32
So I just wanna be really clear for people who are listening. Like, I am interested in Priyanka's, like, subject matter deeply, and we're gonna get into that in a second.But I'm also just, I want all of us to hear this story and go on this journey because I think what you just described is so common. There is something that kind of comes into our world of like, oh, wait, I want that.
Priyanka Venugopal 06:57
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 06:58
I, I want that.
Priyanka Venugopal 07:00
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 07:00
And could I have that? Could I do that?
Priyanka Venugopal 07:03
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 07:03
And for a lot of us, that practical brain turns on, trying to protect us almost immediately.
Priyanka Venugopal 07:11
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 07:12
Probably not you. Actually, you know what? It probably is not gonna work out. Like, why do you think you should be- have that, be that, say that, do that, right?
Priyanka Venugopal 07:19
Mm-hmm.
Sara Bybee Fisk 07:20
And that's very real.
Priyanka Venugopal 07:23
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 07:23
And so what I'm more interested in is like the journey of how you came from probably not me to what if it could be me, why not me.
Priyanka Venugopal 07:34
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 07:34
And what would you say, like looking back, what happened for you between probably not me to why not me? Was your brain gathering evidence? Was, was-
Priyanka Venugopal 07:45
Right
Sara Bybee Fisk 07:45
... did other... I mean, you mentioned the retreat-
Priyanka Venugopal 07:47
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 07:47
... but what specifically about it?
Priyanka Venugopal 07:48
Yeah. Okay, this is so good.So I had zero evidence, and, uh, my, my biggest claim, and what I've been sharing a lot on my TEDx story and the journey is you're not going to have evidence until you do it. So actually, I, I couldn't gather evidence because I had no evidence. But I think what started to happen is I was going on journeys in other parts of my life that were running in parallel. So that's why I say, like my health journey, losing over 60 pounds, that was one journey. And then the next parallel was being an entrepreneur and doing all of the things that we do in entrepreneurship without like a real roadmap, right?
Sara Bybee Fisk 08:23
Right.
Priyanka Venugopal 08:23
Like without step-by-step instructions. The, both of those journeys, my, my weight loss and health journey and my entrepreneurship journey, has forced me to grow my identity and what I think about my potential. So not just what I have achieved. I think in my physician life, a lot of my brain was trained to just look at evidence, which was very valuable, and use just the evidence to drive my decision-making. That's important.But that also started to kind of infiltrate into every part of my life. It's like I need to see evidence first to believe in myself and to take action, and a lot of my health journey and my entrepreneurship journey had to almost deprogram me from that. I had to almost like re-parent myself a little bit in, instead of us... Because I don't have the capability yet, I haven't created the results. I had to practice believing in the possibility of the result. And I have to, like, honestly, for someone like me, who is a... I, I self-identify as just like an overachiever, practically minded person, that was really hard. And that's why 2021 was when I had this idea, and it's 2026. So I think that I, I'm sharing that long timeline because I think online we see these really fast, amazing transformations and these amazing wins, but for me, at least my story, it, it took so long to get there. And I think it was important. I had to go through many iterations of, it probably won't work for you, some flavor of disappointment and inadequacy and insecurity. And I think what started to happen in the, in last year was I started to feel that that feeling, while I could keep it probably for a lifetime if I let myself, not only did it not feel good, it was having a cost to my life right now, with or without the talk. With or without applying to TEDx, me simply feeling the fear and the insecurity really for, for lack of any better emotion, that had a cost in the moment. And I was like, I could either feel insecure and not try, or I could feel, um, a flicker of possibility in myself and try or not try. It's like, which one do I wanna choose? And I think that's what made me ready for saying, "Why not me?" And that just felt better. As soon as I thought it, I actually, whole body, I just felt like, that feels so much better.
Sara Bybee Fisk 10:51
Yeah. And it opens up a whole other... Do you remember those choose your own adventure books?
Priyanka Venugopal 10:58
Oh, yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 10:58
Did you ever read any of those?
Priyanka Venugopal 11:00
Yes. Yeah, yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 11:00
I actually did not like them 'cause I was like, "I just want a story. Just tell me a story."
Priyanka Venugopal 11:04
Yeah. Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 11:04
But that, what it reminds me of is like I just chose a different door, and I walked through a different door.
Priyanka Venugopal 11:10
Mm-hmm.
Sara Bybee Fisk 11:11
Now, I wanna go back for just a, a second because if you're listening to this, and if you listen to me, what came up for me when you were talking about, like, needing evidence before I take action, when we have these hard conversations that we're avoiding and we just keep ruminating and I could say this, and then he would say that, and then w- how would I handle that? And that's-
Priyanka Venugopal 11:32
Mm-hmm
Sara Bybee Fisk 11:32
... the part of our brain that's saying, "I want the evidence that I'm gonna be able to survive this before I have the hard conversation." And we, we know how much time we burn there.
Priyanka Venugopal 11:43
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 11:43
How much of our actual energy and brain space and resources just, you know-
Priyanka Venugopal 11:49
Mm-hmm
Sara Bybee Fisk 11:50
... are, are leaking out of us every single day. And so that switch from, I need to know first how this is gonna go, that it, that I'm gonna be okay, very human.That's why we're all still here, 'cause we, you know, have these survival mechanisms, but there are certain- ... journeys that that cannot take you on.
Priyanka Venugopal 12:12
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 12:13
There are certain experiences that you just won't ever have if needing evidence before you, you know, step out into the unknown is, is kind of a permanent state. And if you're there, that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with you, right?
Priyanka Venugopal 12:26
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 12:26
That's absolutely a stop. But I want to talk about how did you know when you were believing in the possibility of the result at a higher percentage than worried about the outcome?
Priyanka Venugopal 12:45
Yeah. Yeah, there was a couple of steps, actually. So there was... I- it's like if you think about, uh, one of those scales where it's like a seesaw, for the majority of the years that I had the idea but then I would squash it, I was letting fear, the fear of failing, effectively the fear of not knowing exactly how to do it and exactly how it's gonna turn out, I let the fear as an emotion drive my decision to not even try. And I think what started happening last year was I actually didn't start believing in myself or magically having new thoughts. The desire for the result started to outweigh the fear.So the desire, like the, like, that, it's almost like that imagination bug could not, um, could, it, it, it sort, it w- it had been growing. So the desire for the outcome started to outweigh my fear of it. And when that happened, that was when, um, I, I think I had been preparing without realizing it through my health journey and my entrepreneurial journey. Like, instead of me trying to flash forward and believing in the final outcome, I can completely believe in the fact, like, if I just look at the next 30 days, I can believe I, I know how to open an internet browser and, and look this up. And I know how to maybe apply or maybe reach out to an expert or a mentor or someone that has actually walked this path. Maybe I can reach out to someone who this is their area of expertise and have them guide me so I don't have to DIY this as I expertly do in so many other areas. So it's almost like those actions could only happen when I started to feel the desire more than the fear. The same thing happened with weight loss for me. The desire to finally solve the problem was outweighing my fear of failing again, and I think that that's true of anything that feels, again, for the practically minded person, challenging.
Sara Bybee Fisk 14:30
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 14:31
And, um, and we haven't said, but the topic of my TEDx talk was overthinking. So again, like, I, and I share this in the talk, the irony is not lost on me.I, I literally think of myself as an expert overthinker. I live in a time machine where I'm flashing back to the past, flashing forward. It's like we live in time machines, and we don't even realize it's taking us out of just this one moment, which is the only one we actually control. So that's, I think, what the biggest driver was. It was desire.
Sara Bybee Fisk 15:00
So it sounds like w- you got to a point where you felt, or you were able to notice, like, there are steps to this, and I can take this step.
Priyanka Venugopal 15:10
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 15:10
And it doesn't mean anything about the next step or the any, any of the 10 steps after that, but I can take this step, then I can take-
Priyanka Venugopal 15:15
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 15:15
... the next step, and I can handle just one at a time instead of just letting that big fear shut it all down.
Priyanka Venugopal 15:22
Yeah, I think we have a tendency, at least overachievers have a tendency of looking at the whole mountain, and then we feel overwhelmed.
Sara Bybee Fisk 15:28
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 15:29
And it looks so big and so far away, so very naturally our brain's like, "Well, it's probably too big." Like, you already-
Sara Bybee Fisk 15:35
Yeah
Priyanka Venugopal 15:35
... have a lot of other things going on. And especially if you're a mom and you have a career, like, you have other responsibilities, so it makes sense that your brain's trying to protect your energy.But I think what started to happen for me, so I was like, well, I could just look at the next step. And the other thought I had, so the one was the desire, but the other thought I had, and this is, this thought was built on the back of my health and weight loss journey. And that was, worst thing that happens is you get rejected. Worst case. Worst case, you fail.
Sara Bybee Fisk 16:06
Yes.
Priyanka Venugopal 16:06
Worst case. And I was like, so, like, what then? And I was like, worst case, I would feel bad. I would feel bad.
Sara Bybee Fisk 16:13
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 16:13
Worst case. So I had to really... But I only learned how to, I call that a million-dollar skill, to be able to really hold disappointment or regret or embarrassment, um, without being mean to yourself.And I think that that was, again, what helped me be like, worst case, we get rejected. Let's go.
Sara Bybee Fisk 16:36
Okay. I wanna talk about that in particular because I think for a lot of the women that I work with, probably you as well-
Priyanka Venugopal 16:43
Mm-hmm
Sara Bybee Fisk 16:43
... 'cause we're very similar, and for me, to let myself want something publicly feels like a special kind of excruciating hell, right?
Priyanka Venugopal 16:58
I know. I totally understand.
Sara Bybee Fisk 17:00
To, to-
Priyanka Venugopal 17:00
Totally get it, yes
Sara Bybee Fisk 17:01
... to raise my hand and say, "I want that."
Priyanka Venugopal 17:04
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 17:04
To, like, s- draw the spotlight to me, it feels... Like, in my mind-
Priyanka Venugopal 17:09
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 17:09
... I'm sitting in a, in a room, and somebody on the stage is like, "Hey, who wants to be successful?" And I'm like, well, I, I can't, like, raise my hand 'cause all the spotlights will come right to me in that moment. Everybody-
Priyanka Venugopal 17:17
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 17:17
... will be staring at me.
Priyanka Venugopal 17:19
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 17:19
Tell me what that was like for you.
Priyanka Venugopal 17:20
Okay. This is very, very, very real. And one of the pieces of the process, so I sh- and I share this on my podcast, like, I have part one through five on, like, the, the stages that I had to go through, and one very important part was the willingness to be unimpressive. The willingness to be unimpressive.It sounds like, um, it, and it's, it's very painful. Like, I, I, we can just say there's no way around it. But the, because again, I have always been, especially in my physician life, you always have your stuff together. You're always putting on, um, a confident facade, even if on the inside, like, if there's an emergency happening, you don't wanna be with a doctor that, like, is losing their head. You have to have your stuff together. So one of the things that at least I, I was trained in was how to always have a confident facade, even if you're, like, screaming on the inside.
Sara Bybee Fisk 18:18
Mm-hmm.
Priyanka Venugopal 18:19
Because of that, b- and, and I think a lot of overachievers have this, I never felt willing to be unimpressive. I always wanted to have my stuff together, like look like the person that always has it together. N- I don't wanna look messy or look confused. That's, like, the definition of torture to me. Looking confused or stupid, like... And, and I hate this language 'cause I would never use it with my kids, but you better believe I use it with myself.
Sara Bybee Fisk 18:44
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 18:45
And so one of the things I realized this past year was, like, I have to be so willing to be unimpressive enough to have my back to do the vulnerable thing. 'Cause the honest truth is, and this is with any endeavor, not just TEDx, but with your dream goal in a relationship, with your weight loss goals, like health, whatever it is, there has to be a willingness to be unimpressive because you have to fail to achieve the dream, otherwise you would already be there.Like, we would already have been there if we had to be impressive all the time. And in doing that work, like me, it's a, just a choice. I feel like I... I don't know if this sounds kind of crazy or woo-woo, but, like, I feel like I healed something for little Priyanka. Like, little Priyanka, who was four or five years old, who learned she needs to be smart, funny, the people pleaser, the yes girl, the team player. Like, that girl who felt the need to always be impressive, I'm telling you, something happened for her in my choice of willing to look foolish. And now I'm just like, "Bring it on." Like, I'm like, n- now, I'm like, "Let's... What can I do?" And, like, the bigger the fool I make of myself, like, let's, let's just go. It's so incredibly freeing, and also terrifying.
Sara Bybee Fisk 19:59
At the same time. I lo- Well, if you break all of that down, it's your willingness to feel whatever the feeling is-
Priyanka Venugopal 20:08
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 20:08
... when you think, "This is not impressive enough."
Priyanka Venugopal 20:11
Mm-hmm.
Sara Bybee Fisk 20:11
"They are not impressed with me."
Priyanka Venugopal 20:12
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 20:13
Right?
Priyanka Venugopal 20:13
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 20:14
Shame, judgment-
Priyanka Venugopal 20:15
So much shame
Sara Bybee Fisk 20:15
... criticism.
Priyanka Venugopal 20:16
Embarrassment.
Sara Bybee Fisk 20:17
Embarrassment. Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 20:17
And, like, what do they think? Like, the thought would be, uh... I would have multiple thoughts 'cause I experienced many rejections. Many, many rejections in my, um, application journey. And I had thoughts like, "See? I knew you wouldn't get there." I had thoughts like, um, "They must have thought my application was so dumb." Like, they... Full-on rejection. Like, "Of course they rejected it. Your idea's not unique enough." So I... And the, the good news is because of coaching, and I think self-awareness and being aware of my thoughts, I... Sometimes those thoughts will run amok for a little while, but I think the more practice you do with catching your thoughts, the more I would, the faster I would catch it. I'd be like, "Oh, that's so cute that we're doing that."
Sara Bybee Fisk 21:01
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 21:01
"That's so cute." So I started to have a sense of almost playfulness when I... And, and to me, that's what would regulate my nervous system.For me, awareness around my most critical thoughts, we can get really logical about it, but I like to catch my thoughts with playfulness.
Sara Bybee Fisk 21:17
Mm-hmm.
Priyanka Venugopal 21:17
Like, "That's so cute. That's so cute that you think that." And that immediately would soften the critic, um, that would come up, and we'd go again.
Sara Bybee Fisk 21:28
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 21:28
And the more you go, and this is the other thing, it's, um, the way that you build the skill, it's like you have to put the reps in. So the more times you apply, the more times you let yourself feel foolish and unimpressive, the better you get at it.It's like any muscle you take to the gym. So I'm like, "Okay. I guess my job is to really put in a lot of reps to look unimpressive." There we go.
Sara Bybee Fisk 21:52
I love that because for me, the willingness to be unimpressive shows up, uh, slightly differently. It's the willingness to look like a beginner.
Priyanka Venugopal 22:01
Mm-hmm.
Sara Bybee Fisk 22:01
Like, "I don't know what I'm doing here." Because in my brain, there's this, "You should have known. You should already know this."
Priyanka Venugopal 22:09
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 22:09
And, you know, first of all, there's the sheer terror of raising my hand saying, "I want that."
Priyanka Venugopal 22:16
Mm-hmm.
Sara Bybee Fisk 22:16
And then there's the additional terror of if I don't know h- already how to do it... It's like, it's one thing if I raise my hand and say, "I want that," and then I can get up on the stage and I have this amazing performance, right?
Priyanka Venugopal 22:27
Mm-hmm.
Sara Bybee Fisk 22:28
Because that, that redeems that earlier vulnerability of just wanting something. But if there's nothing redeeming after that, now I just have to let myself be a beginner and ask questions wh- that I think I should already know the answer to, and get help that I should already know how to do.
Priyanka Venugopal 22:45
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 22:45
And get feedback that I should have already implemented because why didn't you know this already?
Priyanka Venugopal 22:50
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 22:51
That is-
Priyanka Venugopal 22:52
Okay. There is one thing.
Sara Bybee Fisk 22:53
Yes. Go.
Priyanka Venugopal 22:53
This is one thing, and this has, um, this is one of the... I call this, it's almost like a secret sauce ingredient that I think overachievers didn't know we needed, but we very much do. How do you decide to be willing to fail? But that's basically what we're signing up for.Like, it's r- I don't know what the percentage is. I'm sure it's very low, where you just apply on the first time and you just get the dream TEDx talk of your dream. Like, I don't think that that happens. So why would any of us smart overachievers sign up to fail? Or how can we make ourselves willing? And for me, that came from feeling an immense amount of pride in myself for trying. And so I literally have a script in my brain. I think of it as, like, I've retrained my brain because of the thoughts I'm having. And again, this is applied to my fitness health goals, to entrepreneurship, and now to TEDx, because I have failed m- so much in the last five years. Way more than I ever failed to get to medical school. I did not fail much, actually. That's how I got to medical school.
Sara Bybee Fisk 23:56
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 23:56
But in the last five years, I have failed more than I did in the last 40 X years of my life. And one of the things that I do now, 'cause we have a, we have an op- opportunity. There's a fork in the road. You experience a failure. What most of us do, we'll have the self-critical thoughts, which sounds practical. Like, "There you go. Like, of course you didn't get it. You probably never will." Like, "You're not worth the, the deserving of this goal." And what we have to do is we have to catch that and be like, "Let's rewind," like pause that DVD, and there's another fork in the road. And this will feel disconcerting and uncomfortable if you're new to this, but it's like, I'm so proud of you for trying. That was so uncomfortable, and I know you feel terrible about this rejection, but I'm so proud of you for submitting it.And I feel like this whole body, like I feel like I'm being given a hug by a big person that loves me. And that's, I think, part of what helped heal almost like that little girl who felt-
Sara Bybee Fisk 24:48
Yeah
Priyanka Venugopal 24:48
... the need to be impressive. It's like being so proud of yourself for doing the hard thing, and I have just found that that has... Our brains have neuroplasticity, so we can retrain some of our habits, and to me, this has been a big part of it.
Sara Bybee Fisk 25:02
Yeah. This is exactly kind of w- what I'm coming back to personally and with a lot of my clients as well is, is just the, the power of the type of thinking we are doing and how it steers the ship, whether-
Priyanka Venugopal 25:18
Everything
Sara Bybee Fisk 25:18
... you're, you're aware of it or not. And how do you decide to be willing to fail? I think that is the question that every woman who is avoiding a hard conversation, right-
Priyanka Venugopal 25:31
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 25:31
... who really wants to address something tender, vulnerable, perhaps scary or, you know, overwhelming, that's, that's the question that w- we have to answer to be able to get to the point where we're willing-
Priyanka Venugopal 25:44
Mm-hmm
Sara Bybee Fisk 25:44
... to jump into something, 'cause we can't control what the other person on the other end of that conversation says.
Priyanka Venugopal 25:49
We can't control the outcome very often. And this is even, even with weight loss, where like there's a math to losing weight technically-
Sara Bybee Fisk 25:57
Mm-hmm
Priyanka Venugopal 25:57
... and we feel like there is a math to it.
Sara Bybee Fisk 25:59
Mm-hmm.
Priyanka Venugopal 25:59
But even with, you know, you can eat very little, and sometimes you won't see the scale move. Has that ever happened, where it's like, "I feel like I'm doing all the things, but the scale didn't move"?Even your body with something that should be math sometimes doesn't do what you expect it to do. And so I think that this is where that, that piece where you stick with it because the desired outcome is worth it.
Sara Bybee Fisk 26:23
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 26:24
And I, I also sometimes think about what's the cost of me just keeping the status quo? That's not necessarily a bad thing, but is that, i- is that aligned with what I want for myself really? Is it aligned with my identity? Is that what I want for m- the next generation?Is that what I wanna see my daughter... Like, what do I wanna show my daughter? 'Cause I can tell her a lot of things, but it's a very different thing even she sees me do it.
Sara Bybee Fisk 26:51
I love that you brought up kind of, and, and you've brought it up a couple times, the cost.
Priyanka Venugopal 26:55
Mm-hmm.
Sara Bybee Fisk 26:56
The cost of the fear that kind of kept you from doing it, the cost of, you know, kind of letting that first rejection tell you-
Priyanka Venugopal 27:06
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 27:06
... "Okay, no, you can't have this, and you shouldn't, you should stop trying." But how do you... When you look back at how you dealt with or recognized the cost at each stage-
Priyanka Venugopal 27:18
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 27:18
... because you had to continue-
Priyanka Venugopal 27:20
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 27:20
... to weigh that, right?
Priyanka Venugopal 27:21
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 27:22
This is the effort that has to go into really achieving this thing. Here's the cost of staying here and not doing it, and here's the cost of moving forward and continuing to pursue it.
Priyanka Venugopal 27:33
Yeah. I think about some of our thoughts and our actions as expensive. That doesn't make them bad. And I think, uh, what I used to do is when I would catch myself doing something like self-sabotaging with my health goal, I used to... It would be an expensive thing I would do. Basically like I'd eat my plate of nachos and three glasses of wine and then be up five pounds the next day. It was an expensive habit, but I would shame myself.So I would equate my expensive habit with shame, and then I was never able to really learn from it, whereas w- I have no regrets anymore. Th- I, I talk about this in the TEDx talk, which I hope everyone when it comes out live, you listen to. But I, anytime I've had an expensive habit or a very, um, or a thought that has cost me time with my kids, presence in my family, pr- like peace in or joy in my life, it's expensive. We are on this earth for a short amount of time, and we are spending a lot of time not living it, but I don't have regrets.I think, uh, the way that I think about it is those were lessons I had to learn. Every time I've made an expensive mistake, it was a priceless expensive mistake. It was like expensive, but I needed it to, to really be at, at a place where I was ready to do the hard thing or the, uh, you know, the, the part that I might've been avoiding in the past. And so I think that that's an important reframe.Whenever I say expensive or, um, you know, certain habits have a cost, we don't have to feel shameful about it. It can be like, oh, there's a, there was a lesson there, and it had to be expensive, otherwise I would not have learned it. I- it's one of the... Like, we have to sometimes have the expensive lesson, or it's like, oh, yeah, yeah. W- nothing learned.
Sara Bybee Fisk 29:25
Right.
Priyanka Venugopal 29:25
Like you just keep repeating behavior.
Sara Bybee Fisk 29:27
Yeah. I, I love the way that you, that you frame that. I think that is... It has to be expensive, which oftentimes the expe- what we pay is pain-
Priyanka Venugopal 29:36
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 29:37
... and frustration and resentment-
Priyanka Venugopal 29:39
Mm
Sara Bybee Fisk 29:39
... and, you know, these emotions that show up so much for women who are used to being so capable and so reliable and getting-
Priyanka Venugopal 29:48
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 29:48
... things done for so many people, and when we want something for ourselves, it's painful.
Priyanka Venugopal 29:54
Mm-hmm.
Sara Bybee Fisk 29:54
It is, it is a painful place to be.
Priyanka Venugopal 29:57
And this, you know, this is actually ca- this has come up with my kids. My son, who is, he is a musician. Like, he learned, he's self-taught on the piano. He has perfect pitch. He can pick up an instrument and just play it. He can sight read. He just has that brain. I'm not sure where he got it from because I'm not musical. My husband's not musical. But he's very, very good, and he forgot to audition for advanced orchestra. So he, now in middle school, apparently sixth graders get put into like regular orchestra, w- it's concert orchestra, and to be in advanced you have to audition Number one, he did not audition because he forgot, so it was never on his planner, despite I guess they get reminders, and the second thing is he never practiced. He, he just, because he could just show up and be good, he never practiced. And so two things happened. Number one, he got placed in concert and not in advanced, and the director sent us an email saying, you know, we got feedback from one of his teachers who said that even though he's so talented, his work ethic and his practicing was very low.Let me tell you, my s- it's almost like he had to learn that lesson. He had to learn it without me nagging on him on, "You need to practice," and like, "What about your homework assignment?" He had to learn the lesson of it turns out I can't just walk my way into any room without, like, putting in, putting in the reps. And so he's... It's just interesting. I think sometimes we feel resentful when we don't get the thing we believe we deserve, when I think a much better question is I wonder why I didn't get it. I wonder what was missing. Where was my skill? Where was my attention? Did I stick with it? Was my heart in it? And I think that that just, it's a great reminder to just take ownership of that piece of the process.
Sara Bybee Fisk 31:44
I love that. So you're submitting, getting rejected, submitting, getting rejected. You're, you know, doubling down-
Priyanka Venugopal 31:52
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 31:53
... making changes, getting feedback, getting help, and then the day comes when-
Priyanka Venugopal 32:00
Mm-hmm
Sara Bybee Fisk 32:00
... you're not rejected.
Priyanka Venugopal 32:02
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 32:03
What was that like?
Priyanka Venugopal 32:03
One, one thing I think that happened as I was going through the process, 'cause it's one thing to, to tell yourself, "We're probably gonna get rejected." It's a very different thing to get, like, rejection after rejection. It's like, you know, there's, like, the, the ment- it's in your head versus, like, your heart hurts.
Sara Bybee Fisk 32:18
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 32:19
And I think one of the things that helped me stick with it was I really did take quitting off the table. I really did take quitting off the table.I was like, "I'm gonna keep going until there's a yes." And I think that was just, like, again, the desire f- had gotten so strong. So I just wanted to put that out there. But, um, yeah, in April, I remember, like, I got that email and it says, like, in the subject line, "Congratulations, TEDx Speaker," and my heart just, it was, uh, it, it was, it was just, I can't even describe that feeling. And also what's interesting, a part of me was like, "Is it a fluke? Are they gonna take it away?" Like, it's so fascinating how even then my brain was like, "Is it real?" But, um, really, it was such an important moment for me to have stuck with it, to have stuck with it. I think it was very, very worth it for me.
Sara Bybee Fisk 33:12
And so congratulations TEDx Speaker.
Priyanka Venugopal 33:16
Yeah, yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 33:16
You see that line, and yeah-
Priyanka Venugopal 33:18
Mm-hmm
Sara Bybee Fisk 33:18
... there's some brain drama.
Priyanka Venugopal 33:20
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 33:21
You prepare your talk.
Priyanka Venugopal 33:23
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 33:23
And then it's time to give it.
Priyanka Venugopal 33:26
Yeah. It, you know what was interesting is I initially thought that all I was working towards was that acceptance, and somehow, like, that was gonna be the, the pinnacle. But the hardest work actually happened after that, which was the preparation and wanting it to be A+. Like of course the overachiever came out in me. Just I noticed myself getting very fixated on the outfit, the hair, the, the exact language of what I wanted to say. Every word I was, like, micro-analyzing how the cadence and how it would land. And again, I was overthinking every step of the process, and I realized the thing that brought me back to the day of, even the day before, I noticed myself fumbling a little bit. I would forget lines because I was, like, in performance mode. And the thing that I think brought me back to the day of where I really feel like, in my opinion, w- we'll, we'll see what you think, I delivered it from my heart. It really just felt like easeful, actually, was coming back to the message and overth- why overthinking is normal and also why it's a very expensive habit to have.And I, I think that the day of in itself feels almost like a blur because I had rehearsed it in my mi- I'd seen it in my mind so many times that the actual day of it's like, "What actually happened? Was that real? Did I imagine that entire experience?" But I will say the next day I had to have a conversation with my old self, who had been talking myself out of the entire thing, and asked, like, th- that older version of me, "How do you feel now, having done this?" And it's that, that feeling of doing something that felt impossible. It really did feel impossible at one point, and now being on this side, I just feel like that was a gift. Like, nothing could have bought that feeling. Nothing could have bought that feeling other than actually just doing it.
Sara Bybee Fisk 35:22
That's amazing. What I love about what you have shared is that, you know, kind of my big operating principle in the world right now is that speaking is a creative act because now something exists in the world, your perspective, your thoughts, your, like, y- the intellectual work that makes you unique and the words that you choose to express that that didn't exist before, and that is such a gift to the world because if you don't do it, no one else is going to.
Priyanka Venugopal 35:57
Mm-hmm.
Sara Bybee Fisk 35:58
And I think the biggest problem that we have in the world right now is that not enough women feel capable and confident-
Priyanka Venugopal 36:04
Mm
Sara Bybee Fisk 36:04
... to speak up about the world and the relationships that they want to live in.
Priyanka Venugopal 36:11
Absolutely.
Sara Bybee Fisk 36:12
And-
Priyanka Venugopal 36:12
And you know, Sara, I know we've talked about having hard conversations. Like, the actual conversation is a snapshot in time. The, the, the TEDx talk is a snapshot. It was 12 minutes on a stage. That was the outward expression of something. Or, you know, you step on the scale and you hit the magic three-digit number. It's one moment. It's a snapshot. But the thing that matters the most is the transformation it took to create that snapshot.So if there is that hard conversation- You know, it, it might be easy, like, "Oh, I should just, just, I should just make myself do it." But there's an internal transformation that's happening to make you the person who does it. And sometimes that takes this awareness of what we're talking about, catching the thoughts that might hold you back, having the compassion for yourself to let it be messy, letting it be unimpressive. But to me, that was the part that I'm so grateful for. Of course, the 12-minute talk I'm so grateful for, but to me, I'm like, that was just a moment in time that everybody else got to see. I was the one that got to experience the past year, multiple years rather, of growing into the person who could do that talk. I couldn't have done that in 2021. I wasn't ready for it.
Sara Bybee Fisk 37:25
I love conversations like this because I think they, they're universal in so many ways. Like, there are women who are listening to this who want something, right?
Priyanka Venugopal 37:35
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 37:35
There are women listening to this who have something to say specifically.
Priyanka Venugopal 37:39
Mm-hmm.
Sara Bybee Fisk 37:39
And to be bitten by that inspiration bug, maybe that's happened during this conversation. It certainly has for me.And to work through all of the steps of becoming the person who can make the f- it, it, and it really is kind of a culmination of all of those little steps, like the creative act of, of whatever it is that you want-
Priyanka Venugopal 38:04
Mm-hmm
Sara Bybee Fisk 38:05
... is the culmination of taking a bunch of steps, but also the transformation is what stays with you, and that's what you take with you after the 12 minutes or the hard conversation or the number on the scale finally appears.
Priyanka Venugopal 38:18
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 38:19
It's just-
Priyanka Venugopal 38:19
And we don't see that. I think, again, like when we're so practically minded and you, you're used to the evidence, and like, what do I see on paper? It's like the tangible wins.
Sara Bybee Fisk 38:28
Mm-hmm.
Priyanka Venugopal 38:28
The tangible wins are like the line items on your resume, right? Or it's like the dollar amount in a bank account. These are the tangible wins.But what we're talking about is this intangible win of the growth you have to experience and the way that you have to challenge yourself to get there, and that's why it's like taking a minute after the 12-minute talk or after you achieve the goal to sit with the pride of, "We just did that, and it was so hard, and I'm so proud of you for doing that thing." Otherwise, I feel we, we lose it.
Sara Bybee Fisk 38:59
Mm-hmm.
Priyanka Venugopal 38:59
It's like there's a moment of, um, acknowledging who you've become on the journey that I think a lot of times, I know I definitely forget. And I need friends, I need coaches, I need my peers who have coaching mindset brains to be like, "Priyanka." Um, are you... Like, do you see yourself? Are you recognizing? Because it's so hard to see in ourselves, which is why I think it's so important that you have a coach or a peer reflect back to you.Sometimes you can't see from inside the Coke bottle. You can't see the label.
Sara Bybee Fisk 39:30
Absolutely. I mean, before we pressed record, you were, I asked you how you were doing, and you said, "I'm really trying to just let myself be-
Priyanka Venugopal 39:36
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 39:36
... in the having of this thing-
Priyanka Venugopal 39:39
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 39:39
... and not just bump onto the next thing, onto the next thing, onto the next thing."
Priyanka Venugopal 39:43
Oh, my brain's already, but I'm like back to school. I'm thinking about, like, back to school and what meeting is next and what... Like, already the to-do list has-
Sara Bybee Fisk 39:50
Yeah
Priyanka Venugopal 39:50
... started filling my brain, and it's automatic.
Sara Bybee Fisk 39:53
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 39:53
And the unfamiliar act of actually saying, "No, we're not gonna do that. I promise we'll get to that next week. But for right now, we're just gonna sit with this. We're gonna go on some walks, and we're really going to sit with this experience," that is very uncomfortable.But I also think it's worthy work. It's worthy work that I think is so important.
Sara Bybee Fisk 40:17
There's so much in this conversation that, um, has my brain going, um, even just the idea of worthy work, you know, that you just said. And so if you are listening to this and it is something that has been inspirational for you, you are gonna wanna make sure that you hear Priyanka's talk. I will make sure that you have it. I'm gonna send it out in my email list.I'm gonna have my, uh, coaching group take a listen to it because not only is overthinking just something we all need some better skills around, but the journey that you have taken is something that is, has been so fun for me to watch from my vantage point. To hear you talk about it now, there's so much to gain from that as well. So thank you so much.
Priyanka Venugopal 41:02
Thank you. This is a conversation.I love talking about these things, and I like sharing it in the form of a story when... And those are the ones that inspire me the most. When I hear someone that has gone through the messy, the messy middle, the fails and the epic rejections, and it's not just this perfect picture, to me, that's when I'm like, "Oh, maybe I could maybe do it, too." And I hope even one person listening to this feels a little bit by an inspiration bug. And if you do, just know that practically minded brains love to squash inspiration, and it's okay to just play with the idea. Just think of it like a dare of the day. Dare of the day to just, like, let it, let it out. What would happen?
Sara Bybee Fisk 41:42
Yeah.
Priyanka Venugopal 41:42
It can be kind of fun.
Sara Bybee Fisk 41:43
I, I, I can look up the website, right?
Priyanka Venugopal 41:45
Yeah, yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 41:46
I can just see what's required.
Priyanka Venugopal 41:47
Yeah.
Sara Bybee Fisk 41:47
I can just do one small step in that-
Priyanka Venugopal 41:51
Yeah
Sara Bybee Fisk 41:51
... in that direction. And, um, I'm so thankful for your time and can't wait to listen to it.
Priyanka Venugopal 41:57
Thank you so much for having me. This has been great.
Sara Bybee Fisk 42:00
As we wrap up, is there anything else that you want people listening to know about you, things you're offering, where they can find you, your podcast?
Priyanka Venugopal 42:09
Yeah. So my podcast is called Burn Stress Lose Weight. It's where I share the most stories, the most, you know, like, unfiltered. I would say call it the most unfiltered views that are, like, on a rampant rampage. And, um, that's me on Instagram. That is my website. And I have a whole host of offers that I do. I have a retreat that I'm doing. I think we might be sold out already, but we might have one or two spots left.And then I have my coaching program, which is The Unstoppable Group, where we really work on losing weight without tracking calories, points, w- food logs, and really reconnecting with your body and your gut and how you feel better. You start to... Like, it starts to show up everywhere. So you can get all that at the website, and of course my TEDx talk, when it's live, will be there, too.
Sara Bybee Fisk 42:57
Amazing. Thank you so much, Priyanka.
Priyanka Venugopal 42:59
Thanks.
